Steel bush set flywheel-gear ring 15CV modification

Traction Owner’s Club Forums 6 Cylinder Technical Steel bush set flywheel-gear ring 15CV modification

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  • #26993
    Mark Robinson
    Participant

      Hi,

      I’m after some information on how to do this modification to the flywheel, I have purchased the set but can’t find any info on how it is done.

      cheers

      Mark

      #26994
      Bernie
      Participant

        Mark,

        I am not aware of this kit but I guess from the name, it is designed to replace the three small “silentblocs” at the points where the arms of the triax attach to the ringgear.

        If that is so, the ideal way to tackle it is with the engine out.  However, I assume your engine is in and running and you don’t want to have to remove it.  If that is the case, I can confirm having successfully changed silentblocs with the engine in situ, myself.

        It is impossible to fully extract the ring gear so you will be working in a very awkward position in a confined space on the right hand side of the car.  (I tried underneath but that was more restricted). So ……..

        Disconnect the battery and remove the starter motor for maximum access.

        Remove the split pins and nuts  from the three triax/ringear fixings.  This will entail turning the engine over on the handle to bring each fixing to an accessible position on the right hand side.  Once the nuts are off, the ringgear can then be “jiggled” off the bolts which are an interference fit and so will (should?) remain in the triax.

        As I said, the gear will not come right out so it has to be manouvered into a position giving best access to one of  the silentblocs.  The outer element of these bushes is an interferebce fit in the ringgear so I made an “extractor”, consisting of a socket whith an OD slightly smaller than that of the bush plus a second socket which was big enough to allow the bush to fit inside it.  These were mounted on a long bolt which passed through the centre of the silentbloc with one socket each side of the ringgear and a nut on the end.

        As the nut was tightened, the smaller socket pressed the bush out of the ringgear and into the larger socket.  Assembly of the replacement bush was the reverse but without the need for the larger socket.

        The operation has to be repeated three times and then the ringgear can be offered back to the triax (more jiggling, I am afraid) and the nuts and split pins replaced.  Getting those 3 splitpins back in place was probably the trickiest part of the whole operation because, working blind, it was extremely difficult to align the castellations with the holes in the screws.

        When my second set of silentblocs failed, I was tempted to fit an early ringgear I have which does not incorporte this silentbloc “improvement” but that would have entailed removing the engine.  By that stage, although I was getting adept at it, I really did not want to have to take it out yet again.

        Fortunately however, I was directed to a UK manufacturer of silentbloc bushes who had exactly the right size bush in their standard range and in stock so I devised the above system to replace them.  Their bushes have now been fitted for 2 years with no sign of deterioration whereas the bonds on two sets of bushes I had previuosly purchased from Franssen all disintegrated within months of being fitted.

        I hope I have answered the right question.

        Good luck,

        B……..

        #26999
        Mark Robinson
        Participant

          Hi Bernie,

          my engine is out as it needs a full rebuild Having sat for 46 year’s is was seized so no problem wile it’s out I thought I should replace everything that my be a problem later, you did well doing it engine in.

          anyway I think you have answered my question, my flywheel doesn’t have the silent blocks the ones I bought are solid steel see pic C93C104D-4D92-4406-919E-FA06A79FDDCD5765C69A-CE79-4294-B698-623BFA686442

          #27000
          Bernie
          Participant

            Mark,

            Yes, you have an early flywheel without the silentbloc bushes so the kit you have is redundant.

            The exposed flywheel means there is nothing to insulate the clatter when the starter motor engages with the ring.  My understanding is that the silentblocs were only added to reduce that noise which was perceived as unfitting for a luxury model car like the 15/6 or Big 6.

            In my opinion, the mod was not one of Citroën’s cleverest upgrades.  Having heard vehicles with and without silentblocs fitted being started, I dont think the difference in noise level is significant enough to warrant the change.  On the other hand, the trouble they can cause when/if they do fail certainly detracts from any small noise advantage they may offer.

            As I said, had my engine been out I would happily have fitted the older ringgear I have “in stock” and no silentblocs but I am confident that the parts I now have are very good quality and I anticipate they will therefore be good for some time.  However, should they  disintegrate before the engine needs to come out, I shall not hesitate to replace them next time with solid bushes like the kit you now have in your stock!  With that in mind, I had already drawn up my idea of what was needed in anticipation of having to have some made locally …. but I may now contract you if I do ever need some!

            B…..

            #27002
            Mark Robinson
            Participant

              Hi Bernie,

               

              thats interesting I think I’ll put up with the noisey start up, you are welcome to mine but I’m in Australia.

              they really don’t look to hard to make.

              cheers

              mark

              #27003
              Bernie
              Participant

                Nark,

                Thanks.  I was aware of your location so that last remark was tongue-in-cheek.  I guess you would probably find a taker in Australia if you advertise them.

                However, if you would not mind micing them up, I would be very grateful to know the three main dimensions, ID, OD and Height.

                All the best and good luck with the rebuild.  Pay attention to the camshaft bearings because they are the oil’s first port of call after the pump.  If they are badly worn and causing a noticeable drop in oil pressure, the pressure at the bottom end will also be reduced and that is likely to lead to premature failure of the mains and/or big ends.

                B……

                 

                 

                #27004
                Mark Robinson
                Participant

                  Hi Bernie,

                  no problem will get the dimensions for you.

                  speaking about camshaft I am getting the block dipped so my engine rebuilder has removed all non Ferris metals of it he had a lot of trouble getting the bush that the distributor sits in out it was tight as. Anyway he took the camshaft bearings out and said they are not to good, I don’t think they are available are they? I asked him if someone can reline them and he said we will cross that bridge when we come to it.

                  one thing good is the cam is in good nick .

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